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Title: Hinduism and Theosophy


Nick the Pilot - March 3, 2006 11:21 PM (GMT)
In Annie Besant's book Seven Great Religions, she talks about the similarities of Theosophy and Hinduism. (Page numbers are included):

- the idea of Brahman [The Absolute] 9
- Brahman limits itself by the veil of Maya 9
- Sat, Chit, and Ananda 10
- a gradual, not sudden manifestation of the universe 11-12
- from the concealed gradually comes the manifest 12
- a slow evolution, brought about by the wheel of births and deaths 13
- Man is bound to the wheel of rebirth by a desire for sentient existence 13
- When all desires have been abandoned, a person become immortal 14
- Freedom from rebirth only comes when desire for anything of the three worlds is dead 14
- Karma 14
- Life is a series of stages, climbed into ever-expanding consciousness 15
- Consciousness begins with the uttermost ignorance, enwrapped in sheath after sheath of matter (in order to come in contact with all regions of the univers), bringing forth into manifestation all latent powers 16
- Maya; this world is an illusion. All but Brahman is illusion. 21
- Man rises from stage to stage, ever coming nearer to the Self 23
- Exoteric vs. esoteric teachings. (Hinduism has something for the most intellectual as well as the most ignorant people) 24-25
- Matter is alive not dead. All forms are the expression in denser or subtler matter of the thoughts of living intelligence 25-26
- seven regions in the universe (equal to the seven planes of existence in Theosophy) 28
- Jivanmukti = Nirmanakaya 43

Nick the Pilot - March 3, 2006 11:34 PM (GMT)
I was not aware which teachings Hinduism has in common with Theosophy. Hinduism has a great deal in common with Theosophy. I now have a much higher respect for Hinduism. This is the value of studying comparative religions. This shows how valuable Theosophy is, that it encourages such study. The first and most important concept in Theosophy is brotherhood, and studies such as this are the way to achieve advances in such a lofty ideal.

Nicholas - December 22, 2006 06:33 PM (GMT)
The first Shankara was praised by HPB and his writings are still important for aspirants. The Crest Jewel of Wisdom was the inspiration for the outline of At the Feet of the Master.

Here is one translation done by a theosophist many years ago:

Crest Jewel of Wisdom

kh7 - December 30, 2006 08:14 PM (GMT)
Besant's list is a bit problematic from a scholarly perspective, because the diversity within Hinduism is so great.
But, much of what we would call theosophy is standard fare in various aspects of Hindu philosophy.

As an Adyar theosophist I learned a bit of yoga philosophy (the gunas and stuff) through people who had studies Taimni's translation and commentary in the Yoga Suttras of Patanjali.
Theosophy comes closest (within the yoga tradition) to jnana yoga: the yoga of (direct) insight, through study and contemplation. It also has a lot in common with Advaita Vedanta as Nicholas rightly noted, though Blavatsky did not want to be called a Vedantist.

On Besant's list I see the following problems:

"karma": yes theosophy knows karma, but it's interpretation of karma is closer to Buddhism. In Hinduism karma is often still interpreted as it was meant originally (in Vedic times): not meaning all action, but ritual action.

"Maya; this world is an illusion. All but Brahman is illusion"
This is Vedanta, not general Hinduism. Vedanta is the most influential philosophical school in Hinduism, but to equate it with Hinduism is not realistic.

Nick the Pilot - January 3, 2007 05:02 AM (GMT)
KH,

I appreciate you helping us to understand Hinduism better. What are the main schools, and the main differences between the schools?

I am not sure what you mean by ritual action. What is it?

"Maya; this world is an illusion. All but Brahman is illusion" --> Vedanta but not general Hinduism: How does the majority of Hinduism view the idea of Maya?


kh7 - January 4, 2007 02:12 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Nick the Pilot @ Jan 3 2007, 05:02 AM)
KH,

"Maya; this world is an illusion. All but Brahman is illusion" --> Vedanta but not general Hinduism: How does the majority of Hinduism view the idea of Maya?

Vedic Religion, the religion of the Brahmans that started the whole literary tradition in India, was a ritual tradition. Meaning: when they originally talked about good karma, they meant that all rituals had been done in the way required.

There are six schools in Indian philosophy. I will be writing about that in future (have just taken a class on Indian Philosophy), but for now I'll just quote wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_philosophy) :

QUOTE
    * Samkhya
    * Vedanta
          o Advaita
          o Dvaita
          o Visishtadvaita
          o Dvaitadvaita
          o Shuddhadvaita
          o Achintya Bheda Abheda
    * Mimamsa
    * Nyaya
    * Vaisheshika
    * Yoga
          o Jnana Yoga
          o Karma Yoga
          o Bhakti Yoga
          o Raja Yoga
          o Hatha Yoga

The below is from that Indian Philosophy class:

Of those 6 Vedanta is generally the most dominant tradition - and it considers Brahman as the only reality and all we see as maya or illusion. Generally when we say 'vedanta' we mean 'Advaita Vedanta', which is also roughly the same as the Vedanta of Sankara. Advaita Vedanta is, like theosophy, monistic: the ultimate reality is ONE.
Just to show the incredible diversity: Dvaita Vedanta posits two: God (Vishnu in this case) and the individual lives (jivas). In general theistic traditions have become more dominant in Hinduism over the centuries - which is why equating Advaita Vedanta with Hinduism is so risky.
Theosophists, who are generally speaking lovers of books and respect tradition, would likely argue that only Advaita Vedanta deserves attention as it is 'the original philosophy of Sankara'. But from a scholarly perspective this is unfair or perhaps shows a 19th century perspective (when 'origin' was thought to be an important issue in understanding something).

Mimamsa is the tradition associated with traditional Brahmanism. It considers the Veda's the only source of knowledge.

Nyaya philosophy had four sources of knowledge: perception, inference, comparison and testimony.

Vaisheshika merged with Nyaya - so I'll leave it for now.

Yoga is (obviously) also a dominant tradition. Philosophically it agrees with the first mentioned above (samkhya) which has it that there are two essences: purusha and prakriti. Purusha is spirit, and passive. Prakriti is matter and is everything that changes, including those aspects of our psychology that change.

Mar - May 31, 2007 10:38 PM (GMT)
hope this is a right place..

Vedas said: Universe consists of 8,400,000 species of plants, animals and humans.

* There are 900,000 species living in the water.
* There are also 2,000,000 non-moving living entities (sthavara)
such as trees and plants.
* There are also 1,100,000 species of insects and reptiles.
* There are 1,000,000 species of birds.
* As far as quadrupeds are concerned there are 3,000,000 varieties.
* There are 400,000 human species.

These are concrete numbers.
Does Theosophy agree?

Nick the Pilot - May 31, 2007 11:10 PM (GMT)
Mar,

I do not think Theosophy agrees.

How can there be 400,000 human species? Do you mean on all planets in the universe?

kh7 - June 8, 2007 12:59 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Mar @ May 31 2007, 10:38 PM)
hope this is a right place..

Vedas said: Universe consists of 8,400,000 species of plants, animals and humans.

* There are 900,000 species living in the water.
* There are also 2,000,000 non-moving living entities (sthavara)
such as trees and plants.
* There are also 1,100,000 species of insects and reptiles.
* There are 1,000,000 species of birds.
* As far as quadrupeds are concerned there are 3,000,000 varieties.
* There are 400,000 human species.

These are concrete numbers.
Does Theosophy agree?

It's pretty obvious that there aren't 400000 human species. Anyhow, who cares? Biological science is quite capable of deciding how many species of beings they have cataloged. If the Veda's are approximately correct, that's great. If they aren't, big deal.

Mar - July 10, 2007 02:01 PM (GMT)
Is this concept the same as in Theosophy?

QUOTE
    The Yuga Cycles*

        "Each yuga cycle is composed of 4 yugas. The first, the Satya-yuga, lasts 4800 years of the demigods. The second, the Treta-yuga, lasts 3600 years of the demigods. The third, the Dvapara-yuga, lasts 2400 years of the demigods. And the fourth, Kali-yuga, lasts 1200 years of the demigods . Since the demigod year is equivalent to 360 earth years, the lengths of the yugas in earth years are, acording to standard Vaishnava commentaries, 432,000 years for the Kali-yuga, 864,000 years for the Dvapara-yuga, 1,296,000 years for the Treta-yuga, and 1,728,000 years for the Satya-yuga.

        "This gives a total of 4,320,000 years for the entire yuga cycle. One thousand of such cycles, lasting 4,320,000 years, comprises one day of Brahma, the demigod who governs this universe. A day of Brahma is also called a kalpa. Each of Brahma's nights lasts a similar period of time. Life is only manifest on earth during the day of Brahma. With the onset of Brahma's night, the entire universe is devastated and plunged into darkness. When another day of Brahma begins, life again becomes manifest.

        "Each day of Brahma is divided into 14 manvantara periods, each one lasting 71 yuga cycles. Preceding the first and following each manvantara period is a juncture (sandhya) the length of a Satya-yuga (1,728,000 years). Typically, each manvantara period ends with a partial devastation. According to Puranic accounts, we are now in the twenty-eighth yuga cycle of the seventh manvantara period of the present day of Brahma."

        "This would give the inhabited earth an age of about 2 billion years. Interestingly enough, the oldest undisputed organisms recognized by paleontologists - algae fossils like those from the Gunflint formation in Canada - are just about that old.** Altogether, 453 yuga cycles have elapsed since this day of Brahma began. Each yuga cycle involves a progression from a golden age of peace and spiritual progress to a final age of violence and spiritual degradation."

user posted image


Nick the Pilot - July 10, 2007 04:13 PM (GMT)
Mar,

Yes, they are. The 4.32 billion years of a Manvantara and the 311 trillion years for a Maha-Manvantara are numbers that are well-known in Theosophy. The other numbers are probably close, I just haven't had a chance to check them.

I see your graphic lists 4.32 billion years as a Kalpa instead of a Manvantara, but that is just a difference in terminology. Here are some Theosophical equivalents, which are very similar.

user posted image

SD stands for The Secret Doctrine.

http://www.theosociety.org/pasadena/sd/sd-hp.htm

http://www.theosociety.org/pasadena/ts/sd.htm

DP stands for The Divine Plan.

http://www.questbooks.net/title.cfm?bookid=70

CW stands for The Collected Writings of H.P.Blavatsky.

http://tonh.net/theosofie/hpb_cw_online/

http://www.questbooks.net/title.cfm?bookid=100

Mar - January 17, 2008 09:02 PM (GMT)
Anyone knows where is this from? (picture, concept of time)
What is original source of this information?

Nick the Pilot - January 18, 2008 05:11 AM (GMT)
Mar,

Are you asking about the chart I posted? It is a chart I put together myself. The information inside each square is documented with its source. For example, at the bottom, is a square containing the word Dvapara-yuga and the notation SD II p. 69. This means the information can be found in the book The Secret Doctrine, volume 2, page 69. DP p. 15 means that same information can also be found in the book The Divine Plan, page 15. Each piece of information is referenced with its source.

Yesspiritual - January 18, 2008 11:55 AM (GMT)
Hi Nick the Pilots,

QUOTE (Nick the Pilot @ Mar 3 2006, 11:21 PM)
In Annie Besant's book Seven Great Religions, she talks about the similarities of Theosophy and Hinduism.  (Page numbers are included):


I have not read the book. Did she also explain the similarities of Theosophy and Buddhism?

Thanks


Nick the Pilot - January 18, 2008 06:06 PM (GMT)
YS,

Yes, Besant's books covers Buddhism. It covers seven religions: Hinduism, Zoroastrianism, Jainism, Buddhism, Christianity, Islam, and Sikhism.

She compares each religion to Theosophy. It is amazing how much these religions have in common with each other, and with Theosophy.




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